Dishonest Windows Product Bashing By Linux Users Hurts Themselves, Others

Dishonest Windows Product Bashing By Linux Users Hurts Themselves, Others

The following is actually a summed up response to this type of activity that has pissed us off for years. I have finally pursued a suspected instance, a real incident actually, and gave intelligent somewhat lengthy informed repsonse to these ongoing users and their deceitful posts and portayed a main portion here as example for making Informed Decisions in Computing Security and EXPOSING dishonest Product Bashers to give that FALSE SENSE OF SECURITY to computer users everywhere. 

Help end it, compose your own in advance ! Make your own type Form Reply to save the anguishing time it takes with them (generally they are intentional and have been around for at least five years almost everywhere on the Net. Sickening. They have made soooo many sick ! SEE Vista Bashing as another prime example. These are the same using Linux, Apple/Mac, and Firefox with all the same product bashing lies and misinformation. It must be determined if they are plain ignorant of the truth or intentionally being so miserable as unfaithful to the community of computer users worldwide. Remember dishonest Product Bashing is generally always against Group Rules in any respectable group/list.




Well and back to you….. I must say either you are very uninformed in Security or either than you are an intentional “product basher”. I will not go further but to explain my statement….

Your proponent is your advice of the Linux alternative to all this and here…. (quoted)
<<<If we assist them in living in the delusion that they are in a safe environment, then we do them no favors.>>>
…. is you doing exactly that. I remind you that Linux and Firefox have both been legally listed as riskware in official legal reports not too long ago, and have corrected greatly. Windows has never been listed as riskware. Internet Explorer is rated as the safest browser worldwide since Version 8 and including newer version 9. Microsoft Internet Explorer is part of the Windows Operating System and ergo has already been rated as secure and stable so it goes as being the ONLY browser worldwide to ever achieve “Unix Certification” because Microsoft Windows has been the only Operating System to achieve “Unix Certification” and therefore Internet Explorer being a part of that has been rated that. It is not a separate part of Windows as some add on software or in any bloatware package. It is part of the Windows Operating System. In that Linux has not been able to achieve Unix Certification is just one fact and legally that it is not more safe or more secure than Microsoft Windows – and neither Apple/Mac.

Linux has never denied or disputed these FACTS though you have by offering the alternative in the light of untrue product bashing. Linux speaks for itself. It does not have to lie about other products to make a dishonest buck. I have not known persons involved in Linux to be of such ill repute as one may believe by your promotion of it. You are not promoting Linux but rather dishonesty as false advertising and doing Linux or Windows Users ANY favor at all by your dishonesty or ignorance – as you have not made clear which yet. Ask anyone at Linux in other words and they will say No Thanks we don;t use or need that kind of Product Promotion and neither would we employ such an individual to do so. Linux ezines must stand on their own merit as you must by their posts.

You are spreading a delusion in security by ‘product bashing’ and your facts are less than laughable when examined. This is what “product bashing” generally refers to – based on a foundation of mistruths and open lies. Sometimes it is disallowed at a handful of forums I have noticed and for obvious reasons.

NOT TRUE…. quoted
<<<Here is an example. Someone will find an exploit and announce it publicly so that users will know and expect MS to patch it.>>>
That is illegal. No one may post legally any such code as proof of concept or otherwise that is destructive to networks, equipment, personal or company/corporate computers, etc. on the world wide web for public or private view. My source is a friend who is employed by MalwareBytes.Org in malware research whom I reported to an exact episode of same and was immediately removed from the world web and actions taken by Agencies.

NOT TRUE…. quoted
<<<Then they admit it and say that they are working on a fix. Then they say the fix will be available next patch Tuesday which is two weeks away.>>>
You are OBVIOUSLY product bashing or have made up a COMPLETE FANTASY about Microsoft Windows or are simply completely ignorant of the truth. The vast majority of Windows Users are well aware that through the beginning to mid “XP Years” that Windows Updates were released immediately after testing. This changed a few years ago, to as well accommodate IT on corporate levels, to every Second Tuesday of the month dubbed “Patch Tuesday”. Any CRITICAL or ZERO DAY PATCH/FIX is released IMMEDIATELY as OFFICIALLY called an OUT-OF CYCLE Microsoft Windows Critical Update.

NOT TRUE…..quoted
<<<Those Russian botnets exploit XP machines and while they are doing harm they would not be able to to it as effectively if Microsoft was on the ball.>>>
I just posted correction to your mistruths. The Microsoft “Out Of Cycle” Windows Update immediately patches security holes and/or code hardens. Botnets are not known as primary culprits in these exploits. “Scareware” as term for fake, rogue, pirated rebranded faulty malware infested antimalware products are the primary attackers. The American FBI has listed this as many many many others have. In fact the infamous SpyAxe was about first to do so in the WMF Metafile zero day in Windows half a decade ago. Using ignorance or mistruths via product bashing is NOT helping Linux. You may be even HURTING new Linux users as thinking that’s the way ALL Linux people are – completely dishonest liars and product bashers, what good could the product be ? You don;t want to do that do you ? ! Then don’t !

NOT TRUE …..quoted
<<<It does not affect me and so why should I care if others persist in using an OS made of Swiss cheese.>>>
Again, if you are product bashing via number of Security Updates to Windows by calling it “swiss cheese” meaning full of security holes the nefarious can exploit then we look to Linux Updates and as well your mention of them being published…. If we use your analogy of what constitutes “swiss cheese” let’s look at how many holes Linux has as compared to Windows (which has had a handful in the last year – and I run both a XP and Vista computer…..
Fwd: [USN-1137-1] Eucalyptus vulnerability
Fwd: [USN-1138-1] DBus-GLib vulnerability
Fwd: [USN-1138-2] NetworkManager and ModemManager update
Fwd: [USN-1140-1] PAM vulnerabilities
Fwd: [USN-1139-1] Bind vulnerabilities
Fwd: [USN-1146-1] Linux kernel vulnerabilities
Fw: [USN-1147-1] GIMP vulnerability
Fwd: [USN-1151-1] Nagios vulnerabilities
Fwd: [USN-1152-1] libvirt vulnerabilities
Fwd: [USN-1153-1] libxml2 vulnerability
Fwd: [USN-1154-1] OpenJDK 6 vulnerabilities
Fwd: [USN-1155-1] NBD vulnerability

OKAY THAT IS IN ABOUT ONE MONTH’S TIME ! ! ! Quazillions of Updates. Windows has NEVER had such a caseload of Windows Updates. No need to look it up or go ahead and google it. As source, I have been on Windows with one of the very first Windows XP computers sold in Nov. 2001 to present and Vista and 7 as well – and have had two or three offers from some important security firms actually to boot (I am disabled and declined).

Now via YOUR definition of “SWISS CHEESE” – we are looking at it ! ! ! Linux would be that and NOT Windows. Neither has Linux been attacked on the level Windows has been since it all began around the beginning of this last decade…. 2000 to 2010. Frankly there security departments have not had the level of attack and defense and will NOT achieve their sophistication until the next decade after 2020 IF they were attacked like Windows was/is starting tomorrow.  Again experience is the best teacher in some cases. In security you gain a “nose” and can sniff trouble and were as, or before, it happens. These are the top employees in security.

And the truth is, as I said Linux speaks for itself, here we see how busy they are and produce their equivalent of Windows Critical Security Updates through Update Manager. The ORIGINAL security argument came (and from many people as you speak here) about 2006 to 2008 that Linux, Apple/Mac, and Firefox were virtually malware immune and make Windows look like a joke. This lying and unfaithful and mistruths have been shown as the basis of dishonest or uninformed and sometimes even called “newbie hype” – basis or foundation and platform for “product bashing” and why this is frowned upon and most times actually disallowed by all honest users in the Community of computer operators on the worldwide web.

The truth in the above argument was based upon that 90 percent of all world computer ran Windows and was “were the money” is for those committing cyber theft via cyber crimewares such as password stealing viruses that also ran through Firefox via Java exploits, spyware installations, other crimewares as ransomware. It is too risky and costly for the cyber criminal underground to go “social engineering” hunting in tiny ponds where there is little internet financial transaction occurring – the other 10 percent of operating systems including Linux and Apple/Mac. THIS was and still is the truth about Windows being attacked so heavily and we have not even touched on Botnets via Botherders, Botlords, Botmasters committing corporate cyber crime via their botnet attacks in the form of Denial of Service Distribution Attacks (DDoS) holding corporations worldwide for illegal extortion ! Windows computers.

When the level of attacks happen to Linux and Apple/Mac that have occurred to Windows we will see how they fair. They will either do as good a job or a horrible one being way behind the patch/fix/updates immediately necessary. From what I have seen I would say their first incidents will be as awkward as it was for Windows.

Remember that just very recently both Linux Kernel Org and the Linux Software Repository have been hacked. This has NEVER occurred with Windows save the one incident of the Windows Updates website itself blocked by hackers temporarily during a zero day keeping slothful users from getting the Critical Update/Patch to block them out. These slothful users either by apathy or bad directions from bad or uninformed user helpers or simple ignorance of not knowing did not have Windows Updates set to Automatic Install as instructed and recommended to by Microsoft and the vast majority of responsible informed Windows users as we are and know to be.

NOW I do not wish to take back some compliments I made towards you but I think I SHOULD as I now suspect in your several answers together as I very slightly suspected that you are doing NOTHING but your little PRODUCT BASHING of Windows skit for all Linux Users. I feel the Owner/Moderator of this group should take action for same. I have made the case I feel for that.

The discussion here was not Linux or Windows – but SECURITY – which is what you have dishonestly or ignorantly given  what you called…. (quoted)
<<<If we assist them in living in the delusion that they are in a safe environment, then we do them no favours.>>>
You have given such delusion as to condemn yourself as dishonest in your product bashing portrayal of your position as being security correct with and for Linux to at least all the users in this group and all RSS Visitors to the group worldwide via RSS Readers of Public messages.

I will NOT post again and will maintain my position – and well spelled out – that I feel you have been dishonest and are nothing more than a Windows Product Basher as dishonest mistruths. In security we teach truth to the public so that they are enabled and EMPOWERED to make INFORMED DECISIONS as to computer security and their own security solutions for the same. Product Bashers do their best to misguide this most times as self aggrandizing but are very hurtful to uninformed followers. This is the main reason product bashers in security are immediately disallowed to continue further.

The only way I could not believe you are performing Windows Product Bashing is perhaps for you to read some, and study some, and verify some, and come back with some reply to admit you were ignorantly wrong in your statements. (I am a group owner and would have banned you already ! )

Otherwise I need NOT reply further. My reply of information to you is quite sufficient as just a little more than ‘surface’.

gerald philly pa usa
Amateur Forensics (computer)


–a concerned, VERY concerned Linux User and contributor !
On 11/1/2011 6:58 AM, R———- wrote:
> I meant in a broader context. Windows users will only know that Windows
> sucks and that it is part of the problem, if they experience it for what it
> is. If we assist them in living in the delusion that they are in a
> safe environment, then we do them no favours. Aside from that I have become
> a bit jaded about it all. It does not affect me and so why should I care if
> others persist in using an OS made of Swiss cheese.Those Russian botnets
> exploit XP machines and while they are doing harm they would not be able to
> to it as effectively if Microsoft was on the ball.
> Here is an example. Someone will find an exploit and announce it publicly
> so that users will know and expect MS to patch it. So, MS goes all quiet
> first. Then they deny it when asked directly. Then they say they are
> looking into it. Then they admit it and say that they are working on a fix.
> Then they say the fix will be available next patch Tuesday which is two
> weeks away. A month has passed and those botnets have been busy and the
> problem has travelled aroud the world affecting millions of MS customers.
> That would be bad if it happened just once, but it is the script.
> So, little old me, using Linux thinks, if MS does not care, why should I?
> MS has denied that the said botnets use Windows or exploit Windows, but
> they also say that the world will be safer when XP is closed down. We live
> in  a world of contradictions. My contradiction is that using Linux to help
> Windows users is like peeing on a forest fire when the forest ranger is
> asleep and the arsonists know it. As I said, I have been around the block a
> few times and have lost my enthusiasm for helping those who do not want it.
> So I handle the contradiction of not seeming to care, by using something
> that is far safer and trying to spread the word that it does not have to be
> this way, rather than saving people who do not know they are in trouble and
> are not asking for my help.
> Using an AV for me is not a good use of my time. I would rather be typing
> long messages to you.
> R———–
> Using Kubuntu 11.10, 64-bit
> On 31 October 2011 23:11, G.LinuxDucks<>  wrote:
>> **
————-cut—————-cut———————– /


Question was: Is anyone using antivirus software on Linux ?

Question was…. Is anyone using antivirus software? (On Linux, at a different group)

List of Linux computer viruses
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

KlamAV has included directory of threats built in.

My answer is yes absolutely. If you can’t seem to get Clam for Linux working, go to System>  Synaptics and type in Clam as search word. Mark for installation ALL that apply and click Apply to install them. The
simple Clam download is basically an empty shell. You need like the fresh clam etc to get the definitions and as well you need to open Preferences and set Updates to every hour all the way up to once a day.
Once a day is generally sufficient. They will install silently in the back ground on log in session daily. If you simply click HOME – this is much like a quick scan of all the usual targets.

Yes, getting hit with malware is rare on Linux but not so much anymore. Companies do not spend zillions of dollars making a Linux antimalware solution with Real Time Protection – YES – Real Time Protection such as
ESET Announces ESET NOD32 Antivirus for Linux 
EON: Enhanced Online News (press release)
“Given the importance of consumer and business usage of Linux, it is
essential to equip users with advanced security software to protect
against cyber-attacks,” said Richard Marko, CEO of ESET. “With ESET
NOD32 Antivirus for Linux, ESET’s protection is …

ESET File Security for Linux receives VB100 award [perfect scores
against malware]
BRATISLAVA – ESET File Security 3.0.20 for Linux has received a “VB100”,
the award from Virus Bulletin, UK’s independent testing antivirus
authority. …
Simple or average users sometimes have the attitude of “your not going to drag that windows crap into here – Linux users – are you ? “…. but they do not realize you may be performing financial transactions or are
a webmaster and even using FTP to websites etc. These type users WELCOME such products for confidence and peace of mind in Safe Computing for like $30 to $40 USD yearly. I myself have tried the 30 day evaluation of ESET (best windows at over 59 VB100 Awards, labs can’t lie) for Linux and am seriously impressed and will be using it permanently on my Linux Netbook. I have tried free AVG – as Clam has only a very fair as opposed to excellent detection rating. It completely bogged down the system so bad I could not navigate the computer system. Fighting fighting fighting just to get rid of it ! Finally !

Again, the average user is not even aware of the great botnet plague of the which the Linux operating system has been used as well as windooooze. Freely in Linux there is pipelining and torrents and so on
that are weapons in botnet payloads. There is the infamous IRC Chat Relay used for botmasters and botherders to communicate clandestinely beyond legal authorities in too many cases. In fact as a windows die
hard user switching over to Linux – it was like duhh—- where do you think it all came from. They have no compunction about decompiling software to reengineer it for malware strikes and payload deliveries.
The Open Source community needs to be protected by us as they many times do not have the resources for legalities as do the billionare windows security firms. Read about tunneling to circumvent firewall policies.
This is another area of pipelining. Originally, IPv4 allocation was running out as Windows Vista was released with IPv6 native. All these type communications by malware writers into new Vista users over IPv6
tunneling and pipelining was sticking out like a sore thumb and actually only the stupid would attempt it and like at a softer target such as some unpatched software in the system. That was about the last hope of
fresh air in a malware free internet since about the day the first virus went public. Gone.

So, do I use antivirus on Linux… are you kidding me ? You NEVER operate ANY computer without antivirus as minimum security defense. Anyone who tells you different is either security ignorant (newbie novice user) or is intentionally socially engineering you to circumvention of your personal computing security solution (add suite) to make you their mark (IDTheft etc). There is no in between. This is black and white. This is the “cyber ghetto” that used to be called that wonderful information super highway known as the world wide web – WWW …. The more Linux gets used, the more it will look like all the Mac attacks going on and getting worst by the day.

For the average user – If you practice Safe Practices (don’t go to shady places on net, don’t do shady downloads, etc) and you use Clam or Klam and at least scan weekly or monthly you are fairly safe. NO argument
there. Fairly safe. Notice that does not say you are protected. You need a Linux antimalware product with Real Time Protection (heuristics) to be protected.

It depends on what you have to loose and was my reason for this reply. I don’t say “Shut Up” to all those that want to call this “snake oil” and hey dude you are an unwelcomed alarmist spreading FUD  <,_uncertainty_and_doubt>  ==== I say “Wake Up” and history reveals you are a fool who’s money is soon parted. Ask the victims.

I qualify my answer as advancing to IT Security Home/Small Business and Amatuer Forensics (Computer)…. (webmaster). The former are generally those the Microsoft threatened to sue for damages during their last “Vista Bashing” episodes of entire proven lies about Computing Security and Vista itself.

Simple answer… hey guy get Clam AV at Software Repositiory (in System >  Ubuntu Software) built into Linux and use it once and a while and your good to go for now. Try the more advanced stuff when you are ready
or feel the need to. Simple. Understand no malware written for windows or others works on Linux and vice versa – different operating system code.

gerald philly pa usa
On 5/25/2011 5:12 PM, xxxx wrote:
>  Here’s an Ubuntu-specific list of every known (to them) virus/worm.
>  Read the comments on each; you’re pretty immune to all of them

Bad Opinion) Windows Vista for Better [than Linux] Security? I Don’t Think So

Bad Opinion) Windows Vista for Better [than Linux] Security? I Don’t Think So.
The National Security Agency (NSA) recently published a report, “Best Practices for Keeping Your Home Network Secure” (PDF) in which it makes numerous recommendations designed to help home computer users avoid malware and other common problems……
Perhaps and probably Linux is safer than Windows XP would have been a better truthful article here. Linux has been listed at least once as one of the most vurnable systems, and that not by opinion.
The simplest cut to the chase as showing this article as uninformed and not correct are the two following information links. These deal with malware called rootkits which, if infected on Windows, is one of only a couple reasons for ever re-installing Windows – wiping the disk. In fact, a rootkit infection is the only time Microsoft ever offered reinstalling Windows after wiping the disk as only solution aside from Windows 7 users loosing their administrator password.
So the message is that rootkits can run on Linux and can NOT run on Vista (safer)…
What You Need to Know About Linux Rootkits Rootkits are a way attackers hide their tracks and keep access to the machines they control. The good rootkits are very hard to detect and remove. They can be running on ones computer and no one can even know they have been running. Read more to learn how to detect them on your system.
3/25/2011 2:49 PM
Read more | Open in browser
Linux under attack: Compromised SSH keys lead to rootkit
Aug 26, 2008 ….. The U.S. Computer Emergency Readiness Team (CERT) has issued a warning for what it calls “active attacks” against Linux-based computing infrastructures using compromised SSH keys. The attack appears to initially use stolen SSH keys to gain access to a system, and then uses local kernel exploits to gain root access……
ROOTKITS UNABLE TO RUN ON VISTA… – Vista’s UAC spots rootkits, tests find
Our Government (USA) made a correct decision.
Another point in real world to consider, however, is how many “zero days” has a system had. There has been a handful over ten years in Windows. Linux has had a few…
Red Gecko: New Linux Zero-Day Flaw
Jul 20, 2009 … New Linux Zero-Day Flaw. For all you Linux users who thumb your noses at Microsoft’s history of vulnerability and large attack surface, …
US-CERT Current Activity – Linux Root Access Vulnerabilities
Home: Linux Ducks
Main Domain: (Windows Help)

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My Linux choice – Ubuntu (dual boot systems, security myth already)

My Linux choice – Ubuntu (dual boot systems, security myth already)

As Administrator of our Forums, I have chosen the Ubuntu Linux. I began exploring Linux possibilities a few years ago from my Windows Desktop. At that time, Ubuntu one click install over Windows PC was just finished up as a prototype. These few years later and the Ubuntu Linux one click installer (wubi) worked like a charm.

[SOURCE: From our website forum…. ]

It has been an amazing experience so far as installed now, Summer 2010. Linux itself is an amazing operating system. I would compare it as being able to ‘do outside the box’ (think outside the box) when you get to that point on Windows when you just wish there was some way to do this, that, or the other thing – and could not. With Linux, you can – I am finding.

I reccomend that on Windows to not use the primary administrator account – but use a second user with administrator privileges (takes a second or two to create another user). The computer administrator of windows seems to interfere in the primary account as launched with things – not specifically Linux, but I have done this and it is running perfect now on – installed from the secondary administrator account on windows pc.

Of course as webmaster of the BlueCollarPC since 2005, I am obviously very, very, very security oriented and share this as a Community Help site – free (Windows OS). We can review original ‘horn locking’ from mid-decade (2000 – 2010) in the several arguments that Firefox browser, Linux OS (operating system) , Apple/Mac were safer than Windows between the two operating system users and conclude that in this new decade Windows users may begin to flock to Linux as a “back up system” to Windows being inoperative due to malwares. This is along the lines that much malware on Windows used the Active X maliciously (like trojans or malware toolbars, etc.) in Internet Explorer browser and the Mozilla Firefox browser operated without it. So the arguements began and the hype and so on that “Firefox is safer than Internet Explorer” and many, many Windows users have installed Firefox as a back up browser to use in the event malware affecting the Internet Explorer in some lock out denial of service manner occurred. In the early days this was working to achieve logging onto the internet when you could not on IE (Microsoft Internet Explorer, part of Windows OS). But cybercrime has evolved greatly in a very, very, very short time and with today’s botnet activities and infections – they can simply block many browsers from navigating to security sites for removal help and software and utilities. There was also a cross-infection that was achieved between the two browsers – Firefox and IE.

So, although this may be true in the Linux add on as a back up system right in the same computer (dual boot) with Windows along those same lines as the ‘back up browser’ – cyber crime no doubt has and is working on some “cross platform” type infection ability – cross operating system malware – to rule this out, meaning as fast as we get there with this idea – they have already seen us coming. Suddenly just a couple years ago, all the Linux and Apple/Mac malwares were discovered and do not forget the other argument – Linux and Apple/Mac were safer simply because 90 percent of the world was on Windows and are the target of the cyber criminal underground meaning Windows users are “where the money is”. This is relating to the malicious ID Theft activity by cyber criminals and other various spyware scenarios and nefarioius use.

In this new decade (2010 – 2020) I obviously predict this occurrence of the cross operating system infection for dual boot observing this – user security options as adding another OS creating a dual boot system computer. It will be exploding with all the ways in a dual boot system using Linux and Windows of how you can use Linux to actually hack back into the infected Windows sytem to get rid of malware infection. This is already possible in various ways. Not long and it is going to be the same with just Windows as with dual boot systems – in worst infections there will be no way in to remove it.

So let’s skip the whole idea of the “back up operating system” , loose a step – they’ve already and are preparing for this obviously – and rather move back onto the idea you want to see and try Linux and maybe surprise yourself and forget Windows forever even and cut yourself a distro or two and ENJOY Linux like your curiosity asked you to. Forget the cyber crime and remain with safe surfing – use Safe Practices and antimalware security softwares and a firewall and you are good to go.

One of the first immediate things I realized in Linux land is, hey, this is great for the kids. Install Linux with Windows and let the kids use Linux and adults use Windows – I mean how can you mess up Linux ? Next to impossible. Plus, virtually all the softwares are the free and open source wares that if the kids want to start downloading everything under the sun – how can they get in any trouble ? Right, there are many educational wares available and plenty of games and so on that school age children can really enjoy and use. This is another reason I plainly see and recommend as a security measure for installing Linux – let the kids have a ball with it ! Again, I mean, how can you mess up Linux ? There is virtually absolutely no infections out there (very tiny tiny tiny amount) – is what I mean about how can they mess up Linux ? Got it ? Get it ! Good.

Highly recommended from a simple user on Windows that turned into a Amatuer Forensics person over a botnet infection this past decade. Visit my http://BlueCollarPC.US/ ….. as former Webmaster of the BlueCollarPC.Net serving just over 6 Million users since 2005 (Windows security) and our back up BlueCollarPC.Org (closed, now at .US).

July 28, 2010 at 12:00 AM

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